[Green-Activist] on "BUSH OPENS OUTER SPACE TO COMBAT"-byKarlGrossman

[John Hill]

Dear Frank:

Yes, I can totally understand you shuddering at the word "ban."  I must 
admit I hardly noticed how "hard-line" I'm getting in my older age! However, 
I must say that if anything needs banning, it's: "all nuclear power and arms 
initiatives" and "closing down the uranium mining industry as quickly as 
possible" and "keeping our military out of other countries (and cutting its 
profligate arms spending)", wouldn't be bad ideas either - if I may say so 
myself! ;^).

As Arlo Guthirie once sang; "We might start a Movement!"

Best wishes,

John



----- Original Message ----- 
From: "frank" <wetherbystn at bigpond.com>
To: "maillist for Green Activists" <green-activist at lists.altnews.com.au>
Sent: Sunday, November 05, 2006 8:29 PM
Subject: Re: [Green-Activist] on "BUSH OPENS OUTER SPACE TO 
COMBAT"-byKarlGrossman


> Yare, right, John, i'll get right on to that.  (due deference)
>
> I know where you're coming from on the rest, but one thing u said at the 
> end is a problem.  You said that other dirty word,"ban".  The people, the 
> whole human species, has to support, voluntary population control.  It 
> won't work any other way.  You see how they go banning drugs!  Birth rates 
> would skyrocket or u'd get an imbalance decline, (China), if u tried to 
> ban breeding, in any way, shape or form.
>
> But you are right, we shouldn't be subsidizing breeding, either.
>
> See Ya!
>
> frank
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "John Hill" <wynhill at bigpond.com>
> To: "maillist for Green Activists" <green-activist at lists.altnews.com.au>
> Sent: Wednesday, November 01, 2006 8:33 PM
> Subject: Re: [Green-Activist] on "BUSH OPENS OUTER SPACE TO 
> COMBAT" -byKarlGrossman
>
>
>> Dear Frank:
>>
>> Good to see you back on deck! I see I am 1 year older than you so I shall 
>> expect due deference and respect from now on!!! ;^)
>>
>> I was indeed a very fortunate child - first of all for growing up in 
>> Trinidad in the West Indies with parents who loved to travel and a father 
>> who was the most sincere humanist atheist I have ever met, with an 
>> incredible curiosity about almost everything and a very healthy and 
>> well-trained scientific and sceptical mind .
>>
>> But one other big advantage I had was that next door to us lived a 
>> remarkable American woman, Nikki McBride, who had married a local 
>> Trinidadian. In her previous life she had been the matron of the largest 
>> hospital in Chicago but after coming to Trinidad (an overpopulated 3rd 
>> world island even in the 1940s and 50), she realised that she could be 
>> most effective in getting birth-control centres and education programs up 
>> and running which, with remarkable persistence and endless effort, she 
>> achieved. Many of the programs she set up are still active.
>>
>> I can remember her drumming into my head that as a young lad in the early 
>> 1950s it should be easy for me to see that Trinidad & Tobago were already 
>> seriously overpopulated (about 650,000 people on an island about 60 X 30 
>> miles) and the population could be expected to triple by the end of the 
>> century. She made it perfectly clear that if Trinidad had not had huge 
>> reserves of petroleum the population would already have been starving.
>>
>> I was very impressed by these arguments and so were my parents. She also 
>> made very plain that Trinidad was really a microcosm of the larger world 
>> and that what we were seeing already happening in Trinidad would soon 
>> become a worldwide phenomenon.
>>
>> Because of Nikki I decided way back then (about 1957 or 1958) that I 
>> would never have children of my own (though very happy to help ones 
>> already born to others), and as soon as I was able (at 25) I lied my way 
>> into getting a vasectomy.
>>
>> In fact, due to her efforts (not forgetting the many good people she 
>> mobilised) and massive emigration, mainly to the U.K., the U.S.A. and 
>> Canada, the population of Trinidad & Tobago has "only" doubled since the 
>> 1950s.
>>
>> Many animals which were plentiful then are completely extinct on the 
>> islands now - ocean crayfish, manatee, boa constrictors, ocelots, 
>> possums, sea turtles, etc., etc. In that period though, the world 
>> population has gone up about 2 and half times (there are almost 7 times 
>> as many people now as at the beginning of the 20th century - and we are 
>> far, far more profligate with resources per person).
>>
>> I, like you have been deeply despairing of our fellow humans waking up to 
>> all these more than obvious and extremely pressing problems. The last few 
>> weeks (roughly since the release of "An Inconvenient Truth" in the US of 
>> A) there seems to be a slight breath of fresh air (dare I hope?) and 
>> people (and even politicians!!!) seem to be at least talking about them 
>> with some sense of urgency if, often, without much sense.
>>
>> I think we who are of like mind should do our best to encourage all this 
>> debate (even sometimes if we think it is misguided) and make sure it not 
>> a forgotten issue by the next elections (and the elections after that). 
>> In fact, we should all do our very best to keep it (and an end to 
>> warmongering) right at the top of the political agenda as long as we can. 
>> I look forward to working with you and other listmembers on all of this.
>>
>> Some good places to start (beyond all the many usual environmental 
>> issues) would be to put constant pressure on the government to set an 
>> example by keeping our population down (why, for instance, should couples 
>> having kids receive big benefits from the public purse?), keeping our 
>> military out of other countries (and cutting its profligate arms 
>> spending), banning all nuclear power and arms initiatives and closing 
>> down the uranium mining industry as quickly as possible.
>>
>> And that's just for starters,
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>>
>> John Hill